This was in striking contrast to all of the e-mails that I received from everyone of her email accounts (including her husbands) making me have to block each account on my instant messenger, home email, work email, and phone email. But I never responded to any of them, because I knew that was what she wanted as I have seen her do this to friend after friend during the years I have known her. She even went so far as to send me nasty messages through her Netflix account in the form of recommendations! Still I refused to take the bait. In fact I only wrote Kathe to tell her what had happened so she could explain to Andrea that I still cared about her (that email is posted also) because I didn't want her to think I had stopped wanting to have any contact with her or that anything was her fault.
Carmina still kept writing my mother and IMing her when ever she logged on however. She tried to write my mother for information acting as if she was concerned about me. When Carmina started all of this up again, she started trying to IM my mother about it. My mother whose painfilled house bound days where her only escape is the computer that my husband and I bought her. My mother who, for your information Carmina has less than 5 years to live (if you were such a concerned caring friend you would know that), told me this week that she needed me to show her how to log in as invisible on her yahoo beacuse she can't get on her computer anymore with out your iming her about this! If I am angry at Carmina for anything, it is that. How dare you be so selfish and self absorbed to try to involve my DYING mother in your soap opera!!!!!
When I started getting im's again from you (trying to get me to accept you back on my network) and noticed you were making comments on my blog, I knew in my heart that someone had pissed you off and hurt you in your new swingers club so you thought you could write me and Anna would gladly accept and sit and listen to YOUR version of how these people (that I don't even nor will I ever know so how can I know the whole story) had done you so wrong. Now if what you say in your blog is so true about me that I was never there for you, why did you wait until THAT DAY (you know the blog that I posted from your swinger blog that you have since deleted, about how these people were backstabbers and talked trash about you, etc ,etc but how you had secrets on them, etc) to try to contact me again so ardently?
It saddened me to find that blog Carmina because as much as I knew in my heart I was right, I truly did want to be wrong about it. "If someone plays with someone and another person gets upset it makes for a uncomfortabe time all the way around. im just tired of it." "but im not going to want to play and see carm not haveing fun because it not fair to her so i dont think im going to go to anymore partys and we might only play in pairs or select 3 cpls settings". What was worse was after reading your blog and Kris's I see all of the reasons that I had (and I know you don't believe this but it is true) for not talking to you anymore were still there and some were even worse than before. It was only then that I posted your cruel email to me on this blog and my letter to Kathe explaining why I wasn't writing to Andrea (notice the date on that letter too as it was months ago). I was hoping that you would take the hint and stop trying to contact me but you wouldn't let it go! I then posted YOUR OWN WORDS as you admit word for word from your swinger blog and your snarky comments on my blog about how you had found new friends so you would see that I knew the real reason you were trying to cantact me. That I had read that blog. Again, it didn't work and you deleted that entry off your blog (after it had been up there almost a week Carmina get real), and started running me down in your blog something until this entry now, I had NEVER done, check my old posts (I HAVE NEVER DELETED ANY OF MINE), the only time you were even mentioned was during the holiday post where I was feeling sad about all of the hard times everyone I knew was having during this holiday and even then I only said that I had to stop talking to you because you were saying hurtful things about the people I cared about. I NEVER went into your life, your deeds , or my feelings about YOU! As I read through your posts I found several posts mentioning me. You even admit that you talk to these "friends" about me. These people don't know me from jane, but they are beginning to know you as that entry you erased pointed out.
I was firmly of the mind to not talk to you AT ALL perhaps ever again as I told Kathe and I CERTAINLY didn't want to bring up your short comings and misdeads to these people that I don't even know and will never know. I know from your actions that all of that is still a very big part of your personality so I figure these people (unless they are bored and drama queens like yourself, or are really stupid) will figure these things about you in time and on there own without any help from me and at that time they will decide if it is something they can accept in you or not and act accordingly.
BUT>>>again you won't let it go. You are telling and posting flat out lies about me Carmina and you know it is true so I am warning you, you are only going to be hurt if you read further...
Do these people know that when you were squaters in those condemed apts that I begged my friends several times to take me there to bring you and your family food as I didn't have a car of my own? (funny you guys always had cigs and Kris always had pot even when your children didn't have food). "That bout covers it tonite, i have eaten my grits and syrup, which is all there was to eat"
Do they know how I put my reputaion and a friendship with the lab manager at Clinical Laboratories of Colorado (which later became Quest) on the line when I BEGGED for him to hire you even though you had NO job history or references. How I had to tell him that you and your family had been in and out of homeless shelters 3 or 4 times (the last time on Christmas) in order for him to hire you? Do they know you had never had a decent job before that ? That even when you worked for the home health agency they fired you several times and only called you back because, by your own admission they were desperate?
Do they know how many times you have guilted me into lying for apartments and rental properties after you had been evicted or moved out from yet another place owing back rent and damages? (maybe they do as you have probably asked a few of them to lie for you this time around) "not sure how i am gonna handle all this on top of moving" "thursday pop inspection by the landlord."
Do they know that the last time we stopped speaking was when you told me that Andrea had been raped and molested for what the 2nd or 3rd time while living with you (funny nothing like this never happens when she lives with kathe) and you told her NOT TO TELL ANYONE!!! (she was what 7-8 years old!) because you told me you couldn't tell the police because you were already on probation for your house being so filthy that your landlord reported you to social services causing you to loose both kids and being charged with a felony child abuse charge. Did you tell them that it was only a short time after she was raped that time that she tried to hang herself at the fourth of july party where your husband was arrested because he was so drunk and stoned? That you had to hire a lawyer and due to the fact that they had messed up by not giving him a drug test at the scene, that was the only way you got it dropped. Did you tell them that Andrea was getting A's in school till she went to live with you? Did you tell them that your solution to her issues with self esteem and boys was to try to put her on birthcontrol (when she was 11 years old) instead of trying to get her counceling first even after I told you about all of the FREE counceling available you had the nerve to say that it worked for you. Did it now? You still have issues where all you think you have of value is your sexual skills. Don't you want Andrea to know that men can be her friends and that they should RESPECT her as well as she should RESPECT herself, that she has so much more to offer than just her body? (something you still haven't learned).
As for all of the ugly things you said about my husband. Kris did some horrible things during the course of your relationship but the only time I told you to leave him is when he pushed you out that window and was (by your own admission) drugged out of his mind constantly. I even advised you to go to him in North Carolina if you wanted your marriage to continue when you were out here considering sleeping with his brother, your mothers druggie friends, and even a coworker or two. Hell even after you moved out there, when you came back to visit you tried to get your married friend Mike to sleep with you at my house after you had begged me to go get you from your mothers drug dealing shack in the mountains after I had worked a 12 hour night shift the night before and had not slept at all, so "we could spend time together" and all you wanted was a ride and a place to seduce Mike.
You bragged when Kris left and even a few months after he was gone that he couldn't make it without you. That he was so stupid (remember you told my husband and I that you hadn't had an intellegent conversation since you married him) that he would never be able to find an apt or be able to turn the utilities on without you. But he did and boy did that scare you. It scared you even more when his mother was able to get him to stop the drugs something you NEVER tried to encourage during your whole relationship. And when he told you that, that made you even madder and you took care of that didn't you, told them they were cult like and brainwashing him. You couldn't stand for anyone else to have any influence over him unless it was you. You wanted him impaired as it keeps him weak which is what your self esteem tells you he must remain otherwise he would leave you. I don't think that is true as I tried to tell you and even when you were having the worst times with Kris I tried to tell you that and encourage you to go to counceling with him. You admitted to me that you thought it would end your relationship. Your are the same person emotionally I met in 1993, thirteen years and you haven't grown or matured at all but you know something, as much as Kris and I may believe differently about life and issues, I have to give him credit, as I told Kathe in that letter, Kris has grown. WHY CAN'T YOU?
I never called him names and made jokes about him like you always have EVERY man I have ever been with in the time I have known you? (Hell you make fun of Kris enough yourself no one else has too) That yells insecurity to me. The one time you did come up in couples counceling the therapist said, "Carmina does this because she is jealous, that I have always had the educational, career, finacial, and social sucess and all you felt you had that I didn't was a husband and children so you felt treatened when I got those too. I told her that I never though of it as who has more or better, and she said it is pretty obvious that Carmina does because it makes her feel insecure". There you go you finally know the whole extent of your involvement in our couples therapy. Which has worked wonders by the way but you don't want to hear that.
"Yes she was "there for me"but it always came with a price. This is an example of Carmina's version of BEING THERE;
"i am sure you know if you took him back, no matter what he did or what he said that you have given him carte blanche. he is now aware that as soon as you get bummed that he is gone you will cave in on the whole thing, and that if he hasnt cheated yet he can now do so without any real consequences for his deplorable actions. you saw, you listened to me read the adds, this is an old story, and 90% of those guys online were married. i personally dont care what he does or what you do, if you wish to conduct an open marriage (altho i bet you dont get to be open too) that is all on you, and i wont judge you on it, but you better hope that he is using condoms cause if he isnt you will catch something. if your lucky the worst you will get is the humiliation of going in and telling your doc that your beloved husband gave you the clap, if not so lucky...well i am not a great nurse but i have sat with friends dying of aids before (all gay men except one drug iv user woman)and i suppose i care enough to sit with you too."
I don't consider letters like that to be supportive, I take them for what they really are, scare tactics to get me to do what you want so you can feel better about yourself. Carmina never let me CRY on her shoulder, she was always malicious and cruel when I reached out for help. Like she said about her own mother, she knew better than to call her for sympathy because she knew she wouldn't get any, Carmina was always the same way to me. And worst of all she would pry me for every detail she could when I was at my most upset and hurting all the while acting like she needed to know in order to make me feel better (it was partly my fault for falling for the same evil tactics over and over because I wanted to believe she cared) and then even years after things had been worked out, she would bring up those details again and taunt me with them. Is that a supportive friend? She would try to tell me something to cause me doubt time I talked to her, he's cheating (hell Kris did cheat on her but when she was snooping on the computer last year and found he had been in contact with an old girlfriend, I told her that it sounded like they were only friends and that she lived far away so I didn't see what there was to worry about), he's using you for your money and going to leave you when he starts making his own (hell she supported Kris and Zane through the job I got her a Quest and I never said that to her and now who is supporting her, something she always said he wasn't able to do), his mother is trying to get rid of you so they can live in the house you are paying for and throw you out (his mother is now in treatment for her mental illness and on medication and her life is starting to turn around
So while you invite these people that I don't even know (I know you find it hard to believe but I haven't mentioned you to anyone, even my husband , in months because honestly my mood and outlook on life were so much better without your constant dramas and feeding into my fears that I didn't even think of you other than Christmas time when I was mailing out presents and I knew I wouldn't be mailing yours) to your little soap opera of ruining any shread of friendship there was left and any hope there was of an type of relationship in the future.
Has it been good fun for you? Livended up your boring jobless days where you sleep and procrastinate about even simple things like keeping your house decent enough so you don't have to worry about social services or the landlord seeing it? If these people have gone to your house more than once, they know what I am talking about.
You posted on your blog that you wanted people to be able to see both sides so I posted a link to this blog which you promptly erased (even though I had only posted your own emails to me on it). Once again like with Kris, you are so insecure that you are afraid for these people to see any other version that the one you are spinning for them. Like I warned you when you told me you were going to start swinging, I don't care who or what you are sleeping with as long as it makes you happy and doesn't hurt your children (speaking of who is watching Zane, now that Andrea is gone, when you go to these parties? Kris's mother? another woman that you ran down constantly and called a bitch over and over even after she let you live with her, borrow money, and food?), but I don't think yourself esteem and insecurity are strong enough to handle it and as I can see from your posts, I was right. I don't know all of the details of what happened and I am sure I wouldn't even if I had taken your bait and written you back to hear your version of what went on, but I know that it reaks of jealousy on your part.
I have 2 wishes for the outcome of this letter,
1. you will realize even though what I have written will make you mad and even hurt you that it is true and even though I am far from the perfect friend and far from the most emotionally mature person I can be, I have grown a lot since I have known you and am working constantly to grow even more, while you haven't and your life hasn't either. all off the things that you complained about since the day I met you are still true plus some new ones, you haven't (and from the way your blogs read), aren't planning on trying to make any of it any better. You will know in your heart that you are not the blameless victim and will start to wonder why you felt compelled to ruin a friendship of over 13 years. (I didn't start this, you did as you well know, and I resisted responding to you as you also well know)
Carmina maybe if you truly had been working on your negativity and self esteem instead of trying to illicit sympathy from these fast friends you have made with your body, maybe we could have been friends again. Kathe though so and so did my mother. Both told me to take a break from you which is what I was DOING until you tried to stir all of this up again by harrassing me! I hope you will realize that and realize that if I truly had been such a horrible selfish friend to you all of those years, you being as blunt and "honest" as you claim to be, would have ended it LONG AGO! So you know you are fabricating a lot of this, maybe to make yourself sound better or to make you feel better about ruining our friendship, who knows.
I hope that you won't do this to someone else. I hope you will realize that you have serious issues that you need to work on before you can truly be the happy, mature, stable, and loving person that I always wanted to believe was in you but unfortunately never got to surface through all of the anger, self doubt, and jealousy from your childhood and poverty. I hope you will stop being afraid of the stigma of therapy (hell even the self help books on self esteem I got you through the years, you refused to read instead telling me to buy you erotica
Do you think Andrea is going to forget?
Do you think just because you are her mother she has to put up with any treatment you dish out weather it is good or bad for the rest of her life?
Crickett is 5'2" 350+ pounds and on disability. She has never had a real job, drove away the one good husband she had and has a 14 year old son that is so ADD that he can't even pass the 5th grade but she won't get him meds. She is only 39 years old!) Doesn't that scare you? It should. I know you love Andrea, heck Crickett loved Desi too but she was (and unfortunately still is) to emotionally stunted and depressed to function as a healthy parent. I love Andrea and I for as much as I never, ever, ever want to hear from you again, still care about you enough to not want to see something like that happen to you. GET HELP CARMINA! If you get NOTHING else from all of this, get that message. You could be so much more. you could be so much happier, a better parent, finacially secure, you might have the confidence to dress better, get a real job, go back to school, take better care of your health, stop thinking living in a flithy house is good enough, start trying to pay your taxes, bills , rent, maybe even have a savings so you aren't getting your phone, internet, or other utilities cut off all of the time, stop burning bridges with landloards (by allowing yourself to get so far behind on the rent you either get evicted or have to sneak off with no intention of ever paying it, making it impossible to get a decent apt or rental or hell any credit down the line)and jobs by just not showing up to work ever again (so you can't use it a a reference for a better job down the line)heck you would be a better wife and lover, if you just had more self esteem and faced your demons! You are an adult and a parent it is about time you started to act like one! I worked hard to pay my taxes and clear my credit and now we have a house and two new cars. You could do it too! Only your depression and lack of self confidence are holding you back (not Kris like you said for years) You have had 32 years to try to do it on your own and you obviously can't. Considering your childhood that isn't surprising. You owe yourself more than this, you owe your family more than this, you even owe your future and current friends more that this shell of a person that you have become. Please even if you hate me and think I am full of rubbish, know in your heart that I speak the truth about this.
2. never ever contact me of my ill mother again. please LET this go. let ME go. if I am such a selfish and awful friend it should be freeing for you to never have to speak to me again. Take up watching the soaps for your excitement, read the "National Enquirer" but please let me live my life in peace. work on and worry about your own life, stop trying to get information and contact from or about me. Never go to this blog again. It was never ment for you and had nothing about you in it except half a sentence!(unlike your blog), stop talking about me, tell people that it upsets you or makes you to angry what ever and they (if they are truly caring people) will stop asking you about it. I will be just fine without you and I have no doubt your life will continue on it's current distructive path without me. I will publish one more link to this blog on yours (so you can delete it as soon as you find it
"Carmin... Offline everyone is already assessed of the contents of your blog. tag your move" ) because you lied on your blog and told people that you wanted them to be able to see both sides. "feel free to post both sides of this, i mean lets be fair right everyone knows there are two sides to this and i have been nice enough to not post mine, because an arguement and even the end of a friendship is not enough motivation for me to ruin someones day. let alone post they types of stuff that has been posted so far."
To quote you, "take care of yourselves and dont burn those bridges unless u are sure u aint crossing back later."
Carmina's post on my blog (a very different tone from what she has been posting on her blog)
Oh well I tried
I am very sad, and it is very hard to let go of a friend, I am sad that things could not be worked out. I know you are as nosy as me and will check here and I am in no way gonna post a bunch of emails from before or start pointing fingers, I know I was wrong and I know you were wrong. I have started the process of deleting all the old emails all the good ones as well as the bad, cause the only way for me to drop stuff is to not be reminded. My own dumbass for being nosy started this stuff up to begin with. Like I said to someone the other day if u dig for info that you think may hurt you, you are likely to get it. So another day begins and the curtain falls on this one. I mistakenly made the assumption due to the xmas blog that altho the info was unflattering about me on that blog that it seemed as tho there was some hope of working things out maybe just the phrasing. I am not bored I am very busy altho never as busy as you, I am not lonely altho when your husband works nights you are always a bit lonely. I have had a lot of time for introspection over the last few years, the 6 months I lived alone with Zane in the cabin were great for me cause I realized I didn't have to have a man, and that tho things had been rough, I was going to Kris out here in the south because I wanted to not cause I had to, and really barring the occasional argument about money or stupid crap our relationship is stronger than it ever was. I have learned that drama is fun and fine but not a life and have realized I am so tired of not having a life. It is unfortunate that we cannot continue our friendship but I can live with that too. I also have realized a thing about friends if I look I will find them maybe not lifelong call in the middle of the night to cry on their shoulder friends but pals I can have dinner with and just talk about the dumb stuff I did today or our kids or whatever. And maybe that is best in a way cause with pals you don't have a history and you don't have all the deep dark secrets hanging constantly over your head, you just have someone you can hang out with and enjoy their company and know that they enjoy yours. So there ya go it is purged and over and I will mourn it as tho it is dead. It is probably better that way anyway cause it is a new beginning and a learning experience for me as far as what is my business and what isn't and what I should expect and what I shouldn't. I have been arrogant assuming that things were about me and I have made some shitty decisions as far as a parent and have not done well all the time,I also haven't done badly all the time either and where there ae better parents there are worse too. Which is neither here nor there all that matters is that at the end of the day I can look at myself in the mirror and know I am trying my best to do what is right, and some days I can and some I cant. And hopefully what ever higher power there be will look at me at the end and go easy, and realize that I did the best I could with the tools I had. I truly am sorry you have so much anger towards me and I wish that things were different. I wish there was a better form for me to say these things and that I could have made things better. I hope you have the best life you can and that everything works out for you and that things go as you plan and that if not you have the help and support to make it through the bad times. I think that is all I have to say except that perhaps you are judging me a bit harshly and we all say stuff in anger that we shouldn't and that I really didn't get any pleasure from your misfortunes, the hard times you had upset me as the you were family and I wished with all my heart that things could have been different for you.
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